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PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2003 3:26 pm 
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Maybe there is a pattern to where the dung beetles are???

I know of one rancher in Mason who has a lot of dung beetles on his property, but his neighbors don't have any. He says the reason he has them and his neighbors don't is that they are all on a regular Ivomec wormer program and he uses Management Intensive Grazing with diatomaceous earth instead of the medicine.

It might also be important to know that not all species of dung beetles roll up the dung. Some of them eat it right there on top of the soil. Some carry it away to eat it but don't bury it.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2003 7:25 pm 
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Worm treatment was one of the things I had in mind in my earlier post RE: livestock inputs. I believe the connection between ivermectin and dung beetle mortality is well established--yet another warm and fuzzy consequence of our addiction to fast food. Here's one of the myriad Web references on ivermectin/dung beetles:

http://www.esb.utexas.edu/nrm2001/dogdo ... in(Allison)/Ivermectin.htm

Of course, some organophosphates, such as diazanon, are/were labelled for killing dung beetles. Here's an Australian reference on that general topic:

www.dungbeetle.uwa.edu.au/dung/ research/DB%20Abstracts.doc

The H. bacteriophora nematode species, which is included in many commercially available beneficial nematode cultures, is said to be effective for scarab beetles. The scarab reference usually describes family Scarabaeidae, which includes dung beetles. Dung beetles apparently are not predated by Steinernema sp.

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Last edited by Enzyme11 on Mon Dec 15, 2003 1:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: dung beetles
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2003 10:41 pm 
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Location: Whitesboro,TX
Does anyone know if DE will have effect on beetles.
I feed DE directly every day and we have no parasite problems. Question: If you feed DE free choice is it as effective as feeding directly?
Robert D Bard


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 10:31 am 
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I am pretty sure that DE does not harm dung beetles. I've had very poor success with free choice feeding DE -- our horses and cows will eat a bit, but not very much and we have ended up with parasite problems every time we have tried it. I'm considering mixing DE with loose salt and see if that works, but for now we're direct feeding it.

Judith


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 7:45 pm 
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We feed DE mixed with the food, we know how much they are getting and we know they are getting it.
I would think that a dung beetles ecto-skelton is too tough to be abraided by DE. We have beetles on our property but they are not dung beetles.
Tony M


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2003 10:13 am 
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That Mason rancher has been using DE instead of Ivermec for years and has lots of dung beetles. So he seemed to be all for using DE. I believe he mixed it in with the normal mineral.

As for the beneficial nematodes, look at the Florida resources on those creatures. They seem to be species dependent. This means that if you don't have dung beetle nematodes, they won't be affected.

Is anyone using Shacklee's Basic H as a dewormer? In his books, Joel Salatin suggests using a tablespoon per gallon in the regular cattle drinking water (assuming you have a clean trough), leaving it there for 48 hours to make sure the animals drink it, and repeating every other month throughout the year. He says to expect a burst of weight gain during those two days.

A tablespoon per gallon is a pint (Basic H) per 32 gallons (water).

But lest we get too far sidetracked, this thread is still wondering about who has dung beetles.

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PostPosted: Wed May 26, 2004 3:34 pm 
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We've spotted dung beetles on our 8 acres south of Kaufman. Very brightly colored, pretty bugs. I didn't realize they were dung beetles until I saw one in action, moving one of the dogs' messes to a more convenient location.

Just to be sure I understand: we *want* these guys around, right? I can't see them doing any harm, unless there's a problem in a larval stage or something. I like the idea of not scooping the poop myself. :)

BTW, we've only been on this land since last fall. We haven't done anything, organic or otherwise, besides worming the four horses (with the traditional stuff, unfortunately). We haven't even mowed the pasture, so there are mesquite saplings all over the place... but that's a subject for another posting.


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 11:23 pm 
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Yes dung beetles are absolutely beneficial. You want swarms of them darkening the early morning skies if you can get them.

As long as they are saplings, I've heard that goats will take the mesquite back down to the ground and keep it there.

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 Post subject: Dung beatles
PostPosted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 11:34 pm 
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Location: Whitesboro,TX
Back in the "old" days when we wormed
with chemicals, we had no problems with
dung beatles. They just showed up and
stayed. That was in east TX. We have
been here for 5 1/2 years with no chemicals
and no dung beatles.
I have a friend down in Crockett TX that
had a bunch and then felt sorry for her
cows, because they had flies. She put
ear tags on the cows with insectidides
and the dung beatles dissappeared
immediately. The flies came back in a
few weeks. She is now converted.
Robert D Bard


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