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 Post subject: Personal Care Products
PostPosted: Sun Sep 12, 2004 2:33 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2003 10:51 pm
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Location: Garland, Texas
For the past couple of years, we have used J/A/S/O/N Satin Soaps for showering and as a face and handsoap. We have been (and still are) happy with the performance of this product. But, sometimes I want a little change in my life (besides just the various scents - which are great) including the occasional need for a little more oomph for a face soap.

I have done some internet investigation for some personal hygiene products directed toward the male audience. These are supposedly high end products, but I have purposely omitted the specific product names as I don't see a relavance for this discussion.

The one thing I immediately noticed was the huge list of ingredients as well as the number of ingredients I would struggle with the pronunciation and certainly don't know the purpose of said ingredients. Does anyone care to tackle this subject?

Shampoo

Description
A refreshingly cool shampoo that removes excess oil and product buildup without over stimulating your scalp. Used in conjunction with the **** peppermint conditioner and alcohol-free hair gel, this solution makes every day a great-hair day. Peppermint cleans and refreshes, lavender disinfects, chamomile purifies, wheat protein strengthens.


Ingredients
Water, Alkylpolyglycoside, Sodium C12-18, C18-1 Ether Sulfate, Peppermint Oil, Cocamide DEA, Polysorbate 80, Sodium Chloride, Panthenol (Vitamin B5), Wheat Protein, Chamomile Extract, Avocado Oil, Rosemary Extract, Burdock Extract, Horsetail Extract, Sage Extract, Camphor, Tea Tree Oil, Quassia, Lavender Extract, Methylchloroisothiazolinone, Methylisothiazolinone.


Face and Body Wash

Description
Grapefruit and papaya exfoliate and refresh. Ginseng extract nourishes. Almond protein moisturizes.

Ingredients
Water, Cocamidopropyl Betaine, Ammonium Lauryl Sulfate, Disodium Cocoamphodiace-tate, PEG-120 Methyl Glucose Trioleate, Lauryl Glucoside, Decyl Glucoside, Grapefruit Seed Extract, Papaya Fruit Extract, Panax Ginseng Root Extract, Matricaria Flower Extract, Hydrolized Oat Protein, Hydrolized Sweet Almond Protein, Aloe Leaf Extract, Propylene Glycol, Sodium Benzotriazolyl Butylphenol Sulfonate, Buteth-3, Tributyl Citrate, DMDM Hydantoin, BHT, Fragrance,, Green 3 (CI 42053).

Body Wash

Description
Absorbs quickly, helps maintain the skin's proper pH balance. Mild cleansers derived from coconut combine with skin-softening agents, moisturizing aloe vera gel, and jojoba oil to keep skin smooth and soft.

Ingredients
Water, Sodium Cocoyl Isetionate, TEA Lauryl Sulfate, Lauramide DEA, Stearamidopropyl Dimethylamide, PEG-60 Almond Glyceride, Aloe Vera Gel, Cocamidopropyl Betaine, Jojoba Oil, Tocopheryl Acetate, Polyquater-nium 11, Phenoxyethanol, Polyquaternium 7, Disodium EDTA,
Diazolidinyl Urea, Citric Acid, Fragrance, Methylparaben, Propyl-paraben, Ethylparaben, Butylparaben, FD&C Blue # 1, FD&C Red 33


The list of ingredients for my current product J/A/S/O/N which is labeled
Pure, Natural & Organic

Ingredients
Purified Soft Water, Sodium Myreth Sulfate, Decyl Glucoside, Aloe Vera Gel, Glycol Stearate, Lauramide MEA, Herbal Extracts of Marigold, Comfrey (Allantoin), Chamomile, Passion Flower, Goldenseal, Olive Oil, Glycerin, Vitamin E, Panthenol, Lecithin, Methylparaben, Propylparaben, Avocado Oil, Sunflower Oil, Citric Acid, Lavender Essential Oil and Natural color.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 8:23 am 
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Joined: Mon Apr 21, 2003 12:41 pm
Posts: 92
Location: Austin
I can't explain a lot of the ingredients either, but the methylparabens (and other ____parabens) are not particularly good things. They are synthetic chemicals that mimic estrogen, and have been linked to breast cancer in women ... I doubt they're particularly good for men.

I've started getting my personal care stuff from two online sources. http://www.cosmeticswithoutsynthetics.com is fantastic -- not a wide selection, but they only carry stuff without parabens and other questionable synthetics. Kokopelli's Green Market -- http://www.kokogm.com/ -- is not as picky on its products, but they generally list all ingredients, so you can find what you want.
If I can't figure out what an ingredient is or why it's in there, I don't buy it :)

Judith


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 10:10 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2003 10:51 pm
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Location: Garland, Texas
Judith[/quote]

Judith, Thanks for the info and the links. Interesting about the "parabens". I notice that my current fave J/A/S/O/N soap contains both Methylparaben and Propylparaben. And of course the labeling on every bottle is Pure, Natural & Organic :shock: I obviously need to do more reading!

Anyone else? Any chemists out there?

How would you like to receive either of these two in a spelling bee :shock:

Methylchloroisothiazolinone, Methylisothiazolinone

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 16, 2004 11:01 am 
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Location: Weatherford,TX
Mr. Clean - I'll take at shot at some of this. All the products you listed are basically the same. The ingredients are mostly a variety of surfactants which help to loosen dirt from the hair & skin to aid cleansing. Then you have an emulsifier or two, some herbal extracts, fragrance & color. Compare some of these ingredients to your dish washing detergent. Unfortunately the "Natural", "Pure" & "Organic" labels are so over-used and misleading now days that it is hard to tell what you are getting. The product J/A/S/O/N for example says Pure, Natural & Organic which simply means that there is something pure, something natural & something organic in the product (might only be one drop). The product looks OK overall but keep in mind that it is not 100% natural or organic. "Pure" is totally fuzzy. By the way, my source states that methylparaben is a very effective antimicrobial, anti-irritant, & a food grade preservative. It is derived from the palm leaf & is effective against a wide range of bacteria & fungi. Something to keep in mind; to call or label a product solely as "Organic" or "Natural", the manufacture has to use at least 70% organic or natural ingredients. The way a lot of sneaky companies can claim this is to use the water in the product as one of their organic or natural ingredients. Reading & understanding labels is important now days. I'll admit that is darn near impossible though. This is one reason that on the soaps we make, we label them in plain english. An example of this is our cornmeal soap. The ingredients are listed on the bars. They are fresh goat milk, saponified olive, palm & coconut oils, sweet almond oil & cornmeal. These are straightforward & easy for people to understand. The large companies in order to compete & sell products cheaply use the products with the long names that are hard to pronounce. These cheaper ingredients are usually derived from natural products or are chemicals. A couple of examples would be the parabin listed earlier and cocoamide DEA & MEA which are derived from coconut (they lather well & are a mild skin cleanser). OK, my typing finger is shot; hopefully this provides some helpful info.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 16, 2004 4:27 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2003 10:51 pm
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Location: Garland, Texas
KHWOZ,

Thanks for the detailed answer.

You are so correct about the misleading labeling used.

horseranch, made a point about the potential dangers of ___-parabens, I did find this comment. Notice there is nothing regarding the purpose of these compounds and the warning uses only the words "may" and "possibly" but may be the source of her concern.

Methylparaben
Propylparaben


May alter hormone levels, possibly increasing risks for certain types of cancer, impaired fertility, or alteration of the development of a fetus or young child


Your source's description of and explanation of the use for methylparaben makes it appear far more innocuous.

Another product which we used before J/A/S/O/N products, Dr. Bronner's Pure Castile soap is, at least, according to one site's evaluation a far safer product. Of course, if you have ever used this product you will know how difficult it is to read the label :lol: The site lists a much smaller list of ingredients Potassium Solution, Coconut Oil, Olive Oil, Jojoba Oil, Peppermint Oil I don't know how accurate that is. Another similar product is Desert Essence Castile Liquid Soap with Organic Tea Tree Oil. Again, the use of the term "organic". Ingredients listed Potassium Solution (Castile Soap), Coconut Oil, Olive Oil, *Organic Tea Tree Oil

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 3:31 am 
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Joined: Sun Apr 06, 2003 10:59 am
Posts: 277
The bottom part of this link might address some of the ingredient questions:
http://www.dirtdoctor.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1858

I had a link to a site with a fairly comprehensive listing of ingredients in commercial products and explanations for them, but I can't find it now. If I do, I'll edit this to add it. What the ingredients are and how they perform/are intended to perform in the product are fairly easy to find on the Net. What they actually do to the user over time isn't so easy to find. As KHWOZ wrote, the ingredients usually divide among cleaners, conditioners, preservatives, blending agents, dyes/pigments, perfumes, water, and maybe some active ingredients, depending on the product. Compounds below a "small" percentage, I think it's ~ 1%, usually can be described generically as blending or processing agents, which leaves considerable room for items one might not necessarily want to see on the label. A good chunk of commercial product ingredients serve to enhance marketing and shelf life. I suppose we really shouldn't expect to find truth on labels of products that are designed and sold to create illusions, but the implied message of beauty product labels sometimes goes too far. One oxymoron is any white product touted for its Vitamin C content, but there are plenty of others. By the way, the paraben preservatives are variants of benzoic acid, i.e., they're benzene derivatives with the R groups attached at the para positions--hence the shorthand para + ben. Most of the quantity of paraben variants used in commerce are petroleum derivatives, although they can be derived from plants.

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In theory, theory and practice are the same; in practice, they aren't -- lament of the synthetic lifestyle.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2004 8:48 am 
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Joined: Sat May 10, 2003 5:48 pm
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Location: Weatherford,TX
Thanks for adding more info on the parabens. Maybe these petroleum products was what Horseranch was referring to. I did want to add to my original post that just because an additive/product is derived from what was once a natural source does not necessarily make it safe. An example might be the paraben derived from palm leaves. Just because it came from a natural source doesn't guarantee it's safety (just an example, don't know if good, bad, etc.).

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The "soap" you use is normally chemicals, etc. Use real SOAP !!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Sep 25, 2004 9:15 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jul 21, 2004 1:12 pm
Posts: 35
I found a great book with recipes for hair and body care which one can make at home with pretty common ingredients called 'Natural Beauty at Home'.
Rarely do I follow a recipe without making some changes. My kids used to say, 'Make so-and-so again, but don't change it!' Same with the recipes in this book. I experimented with different recipes until I got them just the way I like them.
I found very effective alternatives for everything but shampoo. I can't stand the icky-sticky feeling my hair has after using homemade Castile based or Sodium Lauryl Sulfate-free commercial products. Ick.
Anyone know of a good commercial product or recipe?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 26, 2004 8:41 am 
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Location: Weatherford,TX
What is probably missing in the homemade shampoo is a surfactant. You can rinse your hair with a 5% apple cider vinegar which should take care of the sticky feeling. Good homemade shampoos are hard to make. What you can use instead is a good bar soap.

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The "soap" you use is normally chemicals, etc. Use real SOAP !!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 5:53 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 07, 2004 7:05 pm
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Mr. Clean, I have MCS (Multiple chemical Sensitivity). and can only use chemical free products. Here are a few places I order from. They have good quality products and great service. I have ordered products for several years with no disappointments.
American Environmental Health foundation-1-800-428-2344-free catalog
household cleaning products. some personal products, air purifiers,etc.

NEEDS-1-800-634-1380-free catalog (also carries supplements/vitamins
with no addditives or preservatives, no sugar, yeast, wheat, corn.)
Many personal care products, soaps, mouthwash, shaving products,and deodorant, shampoos/conditioners, etc.
Hope this will help you find some great natural products without all the chemicals. Christain


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:37 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 27, 2003 10:51 pm
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Location: Garland, Texas
Christain, thanks for the information

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Nov 11, 2004 7:36 pm 
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I still haven't recovered the site I mentioned, but this NIH site gives some information about a large number of household chemicals:

http://hpd.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/househol ... ls&alpha=A

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