Organic veggies - cancer patient....
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Author:  chuckfranke [ Sun Nov 09, 2003 9:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Organic veggies - cancer patient....

Good news, the nutritionist who has helped my mom-in-law knock her cancer back (around this time last year they gave her two months - sonce then her CA-125 has gone from 3800 to 40) is telling her she wants her eating organically grown veggies...

So... my father-in-law does have a veggie garden and is anxious for me to help since I redid their flowers/lawn/roses organic. I got questions!

1. His garden (20x50) has good soil, brought in compost several years ago for his garden. Right now it is empty so I mixed in 50 pounds of alfalfa pellets, 20 pounds of cornmeal, 20 pounds of dried molasses and 20 pounds of humate, tilled it all real well to get it nice and active over the winter and sprayed fish/seaweed over it. I'm figuring lots of rotting over the winter and building up soil microbes is the best first step????


2. Any good winter crops i can put in as late as Thanksgiving?

3. I want to pack as much nutrition into what we grow there next spring as possible - any suggestions on veggies/herbs that would be particularly good for picking up trace minerals and vitamins????

Any other thoughts appreciated. This is for a lady who has been given 2 months on more than one occasion over the past 8 years and just keeps kicking the c*** out of that nasty disease.... if ya knew her, you'd want to help!

Author:  Kathe Kitchens [ Mon Nov 10, 2003 12:04 am ]
Post subject:  Veggie Garden

Missed you Saturday...it was a great road trip! The Volunteer Task Force kicked butt on the church cemetary!

For your in-laws' garden: Did you cover the soil for the winter? You gotta put some mulch on that baby! You did some great amending. Now you need to protect it.

As for winter, you can still put in cabbage, kale and some lettuces and cold weather vegetables and they will grow & produce as long as they keep getting watered. It's late but I bet they'll be okay. They like the cold, but not serious freezing. For herbs, thyme, rosemary and oregano can all be planted still and do just fine. My mints just got in the ground 2 weeks ago and they'll probably be fine for a while yet. Love that mint in my tea & coffee. If the tops do freeze, they'll have their roots in the ground so will come back next year so long as the soil is mulched.

Man, I hope I get a son-in-law like you when my girls grow up! :D

Author:  chuckfranke [ Mon Nov 10, 2003 12:27 am ]
Post subject: 

Thanks Kathe,

Knew I could count on ya! Sorry to miss this weekend but i did get to plant and garden a few hundred miles north - nothing like planting bulbs when it is dark, raining and 40 degrees (a-choo).

So what's with this covering and protecting the garden deal???? Use little words - I stupid.

What arte some good cold-weather veggies aside from lettuce/cabbage? I have some Rosemary already :-)

My first thought is to get the worms going in there.... now that I know they are willing to let me take over in there I plan to bring a bucket full of worms from my garden over thanksgiving and get those beds full of castings.

We have a quest here - grow veggies so loaded with the good stuff that it fights off the crud they give the poor woman in chemo every week.... I can cook just about anything and fool her into thinking it is a delicacy so focus ideas on nutrient richness!



Author:  chuckfranke [ Mon Nov 10, 2003 12:32 am ]
Post subject: 

Would putting a few hundred pounds of Alfalfa pellets as a mulch be okay?????? that would make for a cover and could be tilled in for green manure later?

Forget silly notions like economy here - if there is a ridiculously expensive route that is the best way to go - I'm there.

Author:  Enzyme11 [ Mon Nov 10, 2003 6:48 am ]
Post subject: 

chuckfranke wrote:
Would putting a few hundred pounds of Alfalfa pellets as a mulch be okay?????? that would make for a cover and could be tilled in for green manure later?

No, I think the pellets would deteriorate and leave little cover protection; that much concentration also might be too rich for the bed. Alfalfa hay would be a lot better, as long as there's no chemical junk in it. Shredded tree trimmings (not pine bark), straw uncontaminated with pesticides, unfinished compost uncontaminated with pesticides, or shredded leaves all should be good choices. Ordinary hay carries too much potential for active herbicide residue to use, unless you know and trust the source. If you have finer and coarser materials, lay down the finer first and cover with the coarser. If you're far enough north so that the ground freezes hard, you might consider planting the winter crops in a sheltered area and covering them partly/completely with straw or using a cold frame for them.
I saw Roger Swain (The Victory Garden) raise winter spinach in Pennsylvania using the straw cover method (I don't remember when he planted the transplants, so timing may be an issue), but you may not be far enough north to warrant that. This topic is blurring over into gardening, so you might want to post your questions in the Vegetables, Fruits, & Herbs forum.

Author:  Tony M* [ Mon Nov 10, 2003 10:35 am ]
Post subject: 

The "cruciferous vegetables", broccoli, cauliflower, cabbage, watercress, bok choy, etc all contain a compound know to protect against certain types of cancer. All these can be grown right now assuming you can find the plants. It may be too late to plant seeds indoors and transplant them.
We just put some of these veggies in last week along with some lettuce.
I cut 3/8' rebar into 20" lengths, stick them in the ground on both sides of the row on an angle, and bend 3/4 inch irrigation pipe to make a hoop. Each end of the pipe is stuck into the exposed re-bar.
Apply these to the entire row about 4' apart and then run a single pipe down the middle right on top. Tie or screw this pipe into place and you have a solid inexpensive structure to secure a length of floating row cover to.
We ate fresh organic vegetables all last winter with nothing more that a light bulb under the row cover.
Tony M

Author:  Kathe Kitchens [ Mon Nov 10, 2003 10:57 am ]
Post subject:  Got ya covered

Well, looks like you have your answers. Remember my friend, sometimes less is more.

By the way, look in to the herb milk thistle to help support her liver and cleanse the toxins. It is well documented and used by physicians now to help hepatitis victims. Whole Foods or any good health food store will have a proper product in liquid, tea or pill form and people who know about it. Great stuff! Never tried to grow any but it's easy to get and it works. I use it when I get a virus or cold, or when I eat something that doesn't agree with me, to help get the toxins out of my system. Experience speaks loudest.

We're all over the place with this string but hey, what else is new? :shock:

Kathe :D

Author:  Kathe Kitchens [ Mon Nov 10, 2003 11:03 am ]
Post subject:  Mulch

Forgot to answer the "what's with covering the garden?" question.

You need to cover it for the same reason we cover all bare ground. It protects the soil from erosion and compaction, keeps weed seeds from landing and germinating, deters water evaporation & freezing and keeps the temperature more consistant to protect the microbes in the soil, as well as the roots of your winter crop. Easy, breezy cover...oh, that's an old makeup ad. I'm showing my age. Sorry....I wander.

Author:  Tony M* [ Mon Nov 10, 2003 7:05 pm ]
Post subject: 

One other thing, the Captain uses cover crops regularly. You might want to pm him for some ideas.
Tony M

Author:  chuckfranke [ Mon Nov 10, 2003 11:36 pm ]
Post subject: 

Thanx guys...

If ya know someone with that nasty, miserable affliction PM me - my mom-in-law is in one of the best treatment programs there is but it really looked like her luck had run out before she got with a great nutritionist. Is it the diet or did the drugs up and decide to work all of a sudden? I don't know and I don't care but she's getting better and is the best adopted grandparent my daughter could have so as long as she's fightin then by-God we are gonna fight with her and darned sure it hasn't hurt to get off some of the meds and on a proper nutrition program.

Her nutritionist wants her off the anti-biotics they are pumping into her - the docs basically have the attitude that she won't be around long enough for longterm anti-biotics to become a problem (where is the red faced and angry emoticon when you need it?). This might not fit the forum exactly but if anyone else out there is dealing with this one there is a lot of pretty good evidence out there suggesting that diet can help tremendously... sure as heck isn't going to hurt.

One more question - anywhere you can get kelp around Dallas or OKC? They just got back from CA and I had to explain why we could not grow kelp in the garden :-(

While i am pinging away with questions how bout some natural cures for:

Depression - She won't take the anti-depressants and after 8 years of chemo, lymphedema in one leg (oops, they goofed) and Neuropathy (feet always feeling like pins/needles) anyone can get down.

Lymphedema? Her leg is down to normal size now but has to be wrapped nightly and put in a support hose by day.

Neuropathy? - From the chemo evidently - somehow the feet always have that wonderful sensation of pins/needles like when your foot is asleep and wakes up.

Thanks guys, believe me - we are talking about the sweetest, Godliest and most inspirational lady you could ever be blessed to know so anything that MIGHT help is worth finding. If ya know someone who actually deserves her ailments help me figure out a transfer :-)

PS> We have found conclusive evidence that a few thousand tulips, crocus, hyacinths, daffodils, Iris and pansies can make a patient smile in March when it's miserable and you can't be depressed around beautiful roses... :D

Author:  Kathe Kitchens [ Tue Nov 11, 2003 9:56 am ]
Post subject: 

There are some natural remedies for these situations. These are the ones I have found and are familiar with:

Depression - SAM-e, a naturally occurring compound found in all living organisms. This has been used in Europe for over 20 years as a natural replacement for this mood elevator which should be produced naturally but is not in people who are nutritionally deprived or have liver conditions. It supports a multitude of body functions including mood support (depression) by promoting a healthy balance of neurotransmitters, dopamine and serotonin. You can buy this in many places from Whole Foods down to Eckerd. It is a wonderful choice for someone with compromised health because the negative side effects are NONE.

Lymphedema - There are a number of natural lymphatic system supports around. You'll just have to research them and choose the best one. Perhaps a good herbalist could suggest a program, or visit Whole Foods or another health food store that leans toward natural rather than artificially derived products.

Neuropathy - Chiropractic and massage therapy are incredible with this.

Nutritional support is critical for her and I am so glad to hear she is working with a professional. Any nutritionist worth their salt should be familiar with SAM-e and willing to incorporate it into her nutritional regimen.

Our prayers are with you all.

Author:  Enzyme11 [ Tue Nov 11, 2003 4:57 pm ]
Post subject: 

You can find some in-depth treatments of herbal/alternative remedies/therapies at The Peoples Pharmacy, http://www.healthcentral.com/peoplespha ... armacy.cfm

and probably some at Dr. Andrew Weil's site, http://www.drweil.com/app/cda/drw_cda.html.

James Duke's books on herbs and their medicinal uses are pretty thorough and often are a/the standard: http://www.crcpress.com/shopping_cart/p ... p?sku=0743

The Frontline piece that aired last week about alternatives, especially the part about Dr. Nicholas Gonzales, was interesting (as they all are) if you happened to watch it:

Author:  horseranch [ Wed Nov 12, 2003 11:45 am ]
Post subject: 


I'd suggest also looking into Essiac or 4-Herb tea. It's a powerful liver and blood cleanser, and is used for a variety of health problems, including depression and some forms of cancer. I get mine at herbalhealer.com. Another idea would be to find a good homeopath -- I've seen amazing results from homeopathy, when nothing else was working. Nutritionists and homeopaths often work well together - the two specialties complement each other well. PM me if you want more info on either.


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