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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2007 11:42 am 
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Location: Austin,TEXAS
We grow fruit trees (about 60 trees) and blueberries (about 70 plants) in Northern Idaho. Our soil tests show that most of our planting areas are depleted in Nitrogen, yet over-high in Phosphorus. I have been told not to use a manure-based compost so as not to raise the level of Phosphorus. What is a good way to fertilize/build our soil with these conditions?


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 20, 2007 5:25 pm 
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Location: Weatherford,TX
Try this link. Some testing places use the wrong test. If you search this website you will find more info.

http://www.dirtdoctor.com/view_question.php?id=69

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 Post subject: npk
PostPosted: Sun Jan 21, 2007 5:00 pm 
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Location: Weatherford,TX
additional info.

http://www.dirtdoctor.com/forum/viewtop ... phosphorus

http://www.dirtdoctor.com/forum/viewtop ... phosphorus

http://www.dirtdoctor.com/view_question.php?id=334

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The "soap" you use is normally chemicals, etc. Use real SOAP !!


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 02, 2007 2:25 pm 
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A good aerated compost tea recipes will add lots of nitrogen and not much phosphorus if you dilute them correctly.

Good aerated compost teas can be used in a machine to spray over your plants as a foliar application, or near the plant roots as a soil drench application.

Stronger teas tend to be more rich in nitrogen. More diluted teas tend to be more balanced in phosphorus and potassium.

Keep in mind also that aerated compost teas are more biostimulants than mere liquid natural fertilizers. In order words, the beneficial aerobic microbes in the teas will adjust and buffer and balance the correct levels of nutrients to your plants correctly over time, if used frequently, and correctly.

Also if your soil is very rich in carboneous humus and aerobic benerficial organisms, it doesn't matter what a mere soil test says about phosphorus levels! Compost buffers soil pH, and buffers soil nutrients near the rhizosphere of organically grown crops.

Conventional soil tests tend to forget this, when they try to recommend ideas for sustainable farmers and gardeners.

Hope this helps.
Happy Gardening!

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 Post subject: Balance
PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 5:39 pm 
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Location: Dallas,TX
I agree whole heartedly with KHWOZ and he Captain! Compost is your best friend when it comes to balancing your soil. My experience with liquid compost products that contain some humate and molasses has been excellent and the most productive...as well as the most affordable and cost effective. Look i n your area for manufacturers who offer these types of products and you will find that your "test results" make a better fire starter than anything else!
Kathe


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 8:01 am 
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Corn gluten meal is hard to beat if too much P really is a problem but I agree with the others that the quality of the soil test may be the issue here. Tests that don't address what nutrients are available to the plants, and don't give the level of organic matter - are completely worthless.


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 Post subject: some N options
PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2007 3:34 am 
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Location: West Richland,WASHINGTON
First let me say that I agree with all the comments given. Some tests are nearly worthless, and good compost & compost tea is hard to beat.


Yes, most animal manures, especially cow solids without much urine, are much higher in P & K than in N.
Fresher, greener, and with urine (like soaked bedding) is much higher N.
Of course raw manure has it own set of problems, like burning, leaching, salts, & odors. Don't forget food safety issues and the organic pre-harvest restriction of 90 or 120 days.

My best advice for N without P & K is a good liquid fish. Not just any fish, only cold processed, enzyme digested, hydrolasate type of product.

Best one I know is from www.EcoNutrients.com I have used it for years with much success. It is 4-1-1 and is a great bio-stimulant to wake up all the good things in your soil. Can be applied as foliar or thru drip too.
If you contact Eco Nutrients, ask for Kirk Sparks. Co-owner & a great honest guy.

We put 5 gal/acre on our pastures last Spring, at 4% that is about 1.75# of N per acre.
Soil tests before and after the Eco Fish application showed a 10 to 14 # increase in available Nitrogen !! From an app of less than 2#s!
N tests can also be "variable" but the grass took off like it had a 50-80# shot of N, so I believe the test.

I have "known" for years that fish gives you more than the stated 4% but it was the first time I have seen data to prove it.
I would say it definitely wakes up the good guys down there.
We ended up using 3 tanker truck loads between that first pasture shot and when the grain corn went in the bin. Great stuff.

Crop rotation wise, row croppers who use lots of manure (cow & chicken) end up with high P & K and not enough N. :wink: Sound familiar?

They rotate to alfalfa because it will "mine" the P & K back down to decent levels, while the legumous nodules build N levels naturally.
Planting alfalfa as a cover crop and mowing with a flail mower will also build N levels and organic matter on the surface.

Or have a custom hay guy come in and take the hay for for some extra bucks. Get paid for that extra P & K. :)

Not sure if red clover mines as much P as alfalfa, but that is my favorite orchard / vineyard cover crop. Any good legume will put down 100 plus #s of N while reducing your P & K. Can't beat that.

Cheers,
Dave


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 22, 2008 6:51 pm 
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Location: Holland,TEXAS
rinkon wrote:
We grow fruit trees (about 60 trees) and blueberries (about 70 plants) in Northern Idaho. Our soil tests show that most of our planting areas are depleted in Nitrogen, yet over-high in Phosphorus. I have been told not to use a manure-based compost so as not to raise the level of Phosphorus. What is a good way to fertilize/build our soil with these conditions?
Have you thought of adding a legume? I recommend Bur medic it hard to get rid of once it is established. Mulch it down once it has gone to seed and spry with molasses. This way the will use some of the extra Phos and produce free Nitrogen year after year.


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PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2008 8:38 am 
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Location: Kemp,Texas
It would be hard to do with the fruit trees but you could plant hairy vetch or clover in your fields in the "offseason" as a cover crop and each will add nitrogen to your soil.


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