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 Post subject: Pre-emergent for Lawn.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 11:35 am 
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What is good product to use as a weed pre-emergent and when to apply?
I have some thin areas of Bermuda that become weed infested in early spring.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 5:19 pm 
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This is the time for corn gluten meal.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 7:20 pm 
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Now would also be a good time to use vinegar based post emergent to kill the young seedlings of poa and whatever else is starting to pop up. Especially with your Bermuda dormant.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 3:17 pm 
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Thanks for the info northwestener.

Now I have some left over corn gluten that in little granules. Is this the same thing as corn gluten meal and will it do the job.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 11, 2014 3:19 pm 
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Fancylawnmower wrote:
Now would also be a good time to use vinegar based post emergent to kill the young seedlings of poa and whatever else is starting to pop up. Especially with your Bermuda dormant.


Is this something you mix up yourself?
If it's post emergent would you apply this after you see the weeds or did you mean to say "pre emergent".
Thanks for the info. I'm trying to get more organic with this type of thing.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 8:18 pm 
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It's a mixture of 10% pickling vinegar, orange oil, and dish soap. Search vinegar in the library of the dirtdoctor website. You will find the amounts to use. This is a post emergent so if you have no weeds at this time it will do you no good, but if you have small sprouts of grass, or any weeds showing this will knock them out before they can grow.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 8:22 pm 
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Note this will not kill your Bermuda while it is dormant but as soon as it greens up you may want to either pull the weeds. Corn gluten meal is tricky to get the timing right. I've read the window is as little as 3 weeks to 8 weeks protection.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 10:10 am 
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Don't use the vinegar that isn't for human consumption - there are commercial products that are from a petroleum product. It is difficult to find 9 or 10% pickling vinegar in stores in town, but if you go out of town to any of the small towns around the metroplex that have David's Supermarkets (I pick it up any time I go to Grandbury or Glen Rose) they have it for under $3 a gallon.

If you go to a feed store that asks for $10 a gallon you'll probably find that it is the wrong sort. And the 20% type is both the wrong sort and is overkill - too strong.

I've posted information about where to find this in the past, if you search on my posts or search on vinegar.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 1:44 pm 
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Thanks NW'er and FLM.

So don't use the vinegar solution once the Bermuda greens up?
How often can I use this?

Thanks again for the info and help.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:37 pm 
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Vinegar as often as you need to. And I'd love to nuke the Bermuda in my yard - it is the worst weed on the planet.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2014 7:36 am 
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I know it. I hate it. We have heavy shade in the back and sun in the front so I have bermuda in the front and St Augustine in the back.

I love the St Augustine for it's weed control. Not the prettiest grass but it is great.

I've get a large area closer to the ditch that has gotten thin and weeds come in because of it. I'm going to try to seed it in the spring. The soil is clay, so I might try to rough the soil up and apply some amendments, plant seed and adjust watering once it takes root. I think in summer, it wasn't quite getting enough water and thinned out on me.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 26, 2014 2:25 pm 
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Before you seed into bermuda, there are some things to consider.

Why is the bermuda thin? Bermuda is known for not being a thin turf. Is it shady? If so, adding the seed will not change the shade and the new bermuda will soon die. You'll be seeding every summer. If shade is the problem then you would be much better off to eliminate the shade or use a metal garden barrier and mulch back in the shade. Fighting with Mother Nature is a lost cause.

Do you currently have a hybrid bermuda lawn or a common (seeded) bermuda lawn? If you have a seeded or common bermuda lawn, then seeding will work. If you have a hybrid bermuda lawn, like Tiff 419, then you will rue the day that you applied the seed. Common bermuda (all seeded varieties are common) is a much different plant from Tiff 419. Tiff is very well behaved and makes an excellent turf. Common bermuda is a weed under most conditions and will invade the hybrid with a vengeance.

Pictures would help.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 27, 2014 11:55 am 
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Thanks for the replies ya'll.

Dchall:
The bermuda is in full sun and near some mesquite trees. This was sodded a year and a half ago and last summer it got really thin. I believe the problem there was not enough water and I caught it too late in the summer. I just wasn't paying attention to it. Part of the issue is that I have a couple small mesquites that block the sprinkler spray. I didn't compensate for this by having another overlapping station water longer.

I'm not sure if it is Tiff or not. It looks a little different that the other sod in the front yard (about 1/2 acre). The thin stuff is what is what has the weeds. The bermuda around the house isn't bad at all.

So I want to hit the early weeds, aerate and get some amendments down to get it healthy for the spring.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 31, 2014 3:52 pm 
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the tiff 419 will have a much thinner blade compared to the common bermuda. Also the color tends to be slightly darker.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 23, 2014 12:12 pm 
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Getting the bermuda going is the most important thing. Once you get it off and running, then you can use tough love to kill the weeds. Here's the basic bermuda plan:

Weekly during the growing season.
Water once and mow twice. Water a full inch. Mow at 3/4 to 1 1/2 inches high.

Monthly during the growing season.
Fertilize heavily with a high nitrogen fertilizer. Application rate is at least 20 pounds per 1,000 square feet. You can go up to 60 pounds if that is in your budget. That amount will not hurt bermuda. Corn gluten meal and soybean meal are the highest nitrogen sources of all the normal organics. If you want to you could fortify 50 pounds of these products with 5 pounds of blood meal and then apply.

After the bermuda is going and you have mowed it at least 3 times (usually late April to early May), then you can bring out the vinegar and orange oil to kill the weeds. Spot spray carefully. If you can, use cardboard to protect the adjacent bermuda. But if you kill some bermuda, it will come back - tough love.

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